Getting really worked up about NM as I near 8 months pregnant

[seekingme5]

I had another panic/anxiety attack today, and can't seem to shake the anxiety even hours later.  It started with an email I received from Dad today.  He forwarded an email that he sent to his boss requesting time off of work for when the baby comes.  I had asked him and Mom to watch Evie while I'm in labor, and specifically noted that they only need to take a day or two off of work, though Mom said she was taking a full week anyways and Dad said he'd just take a day or two of his discretionary time.

Well, the email he sent me said, "Boss, I have not used any of my discretionary time this year and would like to use several days when my Grandson is born at the end of October."  His boss had replied and said that's fine.

The part I put in bold is what is really bothering me.  I told him a day or two and he agreed, but now suddenly he's taking "several days?"

Apparently Mom and Dad have absolutely no intention of abiding by my wishes that they take only one or two days off of work when my son is born.  Why did they even bother asking me how much time they should take if they're not going to listen?

I can see it now - after a day or two once the baby is here, Mom and Dad keep asking to come over each day they're off, fully expecting me to say ok.  In fact, I can't even imagine how they will react when and if I say "No" when they want to come the third, fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh days of their vacations to see the baby.

The thought of saying "Yes" makes me cringe, so I know that's not an option.  At the same time, the thought of them freaking out and reacting to my "No" with manipulation, barely suppressed anger, guilt trips, and anything else they can muster is what triggered my anxiety attack this morning.

This is supposed to be a special time for Jay, Evie and me.  I'm so afraid Mom and Dad will ruin it by making it all about them and by creating a huge fight because I refuse to let them take over.

Even though I can see the train wreck that's coming, I don't know how to prepare for it.  Even though I know they are expecting to at least stop by every day of their time off, and even though I know I won't submit to their demands and will hold my ground, what I can't seem to prepare myself for is the repercussions of my actions. 

I know I shouldn't let it get to me when they flip out about not seeing the baby, but how?  How do I steel myself against their attack, when I'm hormonal and exhausted having just given birth? 

I am so overwhelmed by the thought of having to deal with THEM while I'm trying to enjoy my new family.

Mom replied to Dad's email and said, ":-) Can't wait to meet him and hold him."  Of course, her email is all about her and what she wants and what she's looking forward to.

I'm not replying to either of their emails.  I wouldn't know what to say except, "I told you to take only one or two days and not to waste your vacation time.  I hope you are not expecting to come over every day, as we need time to bond as a family and we need to keep Evie's routine as normal as possible during this time."

My next therapy appointment is Monday, so maybe she'll tell me to respond and say just that.  I don't know.  I am just so sick of dealing with Mom and Dad.

I'm already planning to keep the next three weekends plan-free (after this weekend), which Mom doesn't know about.  I'm dreading her requests over those weeks to try to see Evie because I'm just so sick of dealing with her!

The only thing I can think to do right now is try to protect myself from Mom right now.  Like, I need to stop checking my email except once a day, and stop posting on or perusing facebook.  I need to ignore most of her calls.  I just need to keep minimum contact for my own sanity, so that these last few weeks of my pregnancy are not consumed with thought about Mom, interactions with Mom, and analysis of Mom's behavior.

It just sucks that I have to practically socially isolate myself just to get away from her.

I think it's really messed up that she's able to affect my entire life like this.  I know it's partly my own fault for letting her, but I don't really know what else to do at this point and how to stop the emotional reaction I have to her antics.

It's messed up that she's just going about her day, completely unaware of how she's affecting me and with absolutely no clue as to how upset she makes me.  Worst of all, is the thought that Mom probably doesn't even know what she's doing.  She's just working on auto-pilot with no conscious awareness of her actions and how they affect others.

It just like the therapist said - any time I draw a line in the sand Mom will do anything to try to cross it.  I guess my "only take one or two days off work" is the line and she's working overtime to cross it.

[RB22]

I don't know, when I was pregnant and the babies came along... I found myself (and my X was similar) in mama bear mode....NOONE was gonna mess with MY babies.  And I was able to stand my ground... BETTER than I was ever able to do non pregnant. 

She blamed it on the hormones.... OK... but the boundaries have stuck....for the most part.

I think you will find yourself in mamabear mode... and if your H can back you up...it does keep her from trying to divide and conquer your marriage.  Then she has 2 people who have put boundaries in place and a N is less likely to cross a strangers boundary than a relatives.

Can you talk to your H about how you would like to spend your time with your son?  Is he on board with your plans?  Is he willing to back you up and keep this family bonding time sacred?   I think having him on your side will help alleviate a lot of your anxiety.... I know it did mine. 

What surprised me was how strong I was in my convictions that she was NOT going to mess with me or my kids..... and it worked.... for all 4 births.

Hugs,

RB

[betterdays]

I told NMIL that no one could come till D was 2 months old, and if she flew in she would have to stay in a hotel and not come here. Period.  Surprisingly, Nh backed me up, I think in a power play.  She visited at the 2 month mark, and did not start manipulating and gaslighting till the 6 month mark.

[honeybearII]

seeking, I am sure your therapist has worked with you on establishing boundaries.  For those of us who HATE confrontation, particularly with a narcissist, it is very hard to draw that line in the sand and then NOT RELENT.  Whether they take 2 days or 2 weeks to watch Evie is a moot point at this time since you really cannot dictate how much time they take off of work.  What you CAN do is say, "We will drop Evie off at such-and-such a time (on the way to the hospital perhaps) and pick her up on (and give them the time, i.e. 2 days after the baby is home)."  Don't get into an argument about it, simply state it as fact and then DO IT.

Let them absorb that, and then in the next couple of days send them another email saying, "Husband and I are letting all our friends and family know that once our little one is here we need alone time to bond as a family.  We love all of you and your offers to help, but we will need (and here list the number of days, weeks, months) private time with NO VISITORS, NO EXCEPTIONS to settle in with our new responsibilities and new dynamics.  We will call or email when we feel ready to have visitors".

I became a grandmother not too long ago and I know the deep yearning to be with the grandchildren.  HOWEVER, I also respect that my son and DIL have a life and THEIR FAMILY IS THEIR FAMILY.  I am a part of it, but I am NOT an intimate part.  I am here to love, support and help out, but what they do in their family and how they raise my precious grandson is THEIR DECISION.

No one can stomp around on you unless you keep changing the lines in the sand, dear seeking.  I wish you strength.
Honey

[LettingGo]

I love how RB talked about Mama Bear mode. While I was pregnant DH and I referred to ourselves as Papa and Mama Bear and as DD as Baby Bear. Biologically speaking, our instincts to protect heighten during pregnancy for survival reason. A woman is most vulnerable when she is pregnant & recently given birth, so our body goes on high alert to warn of  . Please do not write this off as out of balanced hormones, you are feeling out of balance for a reason there is danger. Our bodies have a way of sending signals that are minds do not want to deal with yet.

Seekingme, can you remind self that, "This is my life, my family, my boundaries". I know this sounds so very simple, but it is far from that because if it were we would have no problem living our lives w/out stressing over how NM reacts to our decisions about our lives. Although you are a full grown woman w/a family of her own to take care of and focus on your energy is wasted on worrying about how your NM is going to behave. Your NM is not going to change, you can not change your relationship with her, but you can change how you act towards her. Towards her meaning that you become proactive and not reactive as we did when we were children growing up in the KoN. With normal people you can be empathetic towards their feelings, but w/Ns you can not because they will use your concern for them against you. Kids of the KoN experience Learned Helplessness when they are children surviving in the KoN where they have no power and when we become adults we still react in a state of Learned Helplessness, which we are no longer in aside from a deep fear of abandonment. May I lovingly suggest that you & T look explore the possibility of residual Learned Helplessness & fear of abandonment -- these two are conjoined twins.  

You can not control how NM is going to respond or how anyone else is going to respond. You do not have to justify your decision to anyone. You & your DH know what is best for your family, people who truly love and care for you will respect your boundaries and your desires, and those who don't wont.

Can I ask you a tough question? Have you considered giving someone else the very important role of taking care of Evie for two days while you are in the hospital? To give this opportunity to NM is giving your power over to a Puppet Master who will take advantage of the situation and pull your strings. Some friends of ours  D was under 1 years old and did not want to leave their D w/either MIL or other family member so they asked us to take care of her for 3 days while they went on a business trip. My D was 4 months and theirs was 7 months. I will not go into any more detail, but just say that sometimes considering a trustworthy friend is better than a NM who I believe your instinct is trying to tell you something. I hope you have a back up plan for Evie. If you do not NM will take advantage of that, "if I can't stay for several days then I can not come at all". Be prepared to call her on that. Most likely she will change her mind at the last minute, but if not at least you have a back-up.

Honey's advice, as always, is great. If NM has a problem, which she will, just say, "you did what you thought was best for your family and now you need to love me enough to give me the freedom to do the same for my family. You do not have to understand it or agree with it, but you must respect it by not giving me any grief about it."

Kids of the KoN, like the both of us, are trained to Please the Nparent. You no longer live in the KoN, so you no longer need to please her. My mental/emotional disconnect came before my physical disconnect when I stopped worrying about the Momster's reaction to my boundaries. What happens w/ tantruming children? If you even look slightly in their direction and pay any attention to them what-so-ever the tantrum automatically increases in magnitude and in duration. Therefore, you need to see and treat NM just like a tantruming toddler who has no reasoning ability. As Honey said, keep your boundaries simple, clear, and to the point. There is no need to justify or explain -- when you do this that is a sign that a relationship is not equal and not healthy.   State your boundaries, let NM tantrum, ignore her until she has calmed down and is ready to hear you re-state (NOT change nor compromise) your boundaries because just like a Tantruming Toddler she will be happy that you compromised your boundaries, but she will be even more happy that you compromised yourself and she will not respect your for compromise, and in fact you have devalued self in her eyes. Compromise of Boundaries = Compromise of Self.

Your boundaries are only as strong as their consequences. How about instead of wasting your energy stressing about NM reactions to your boundaries, you & DH look for a reliable and trustworthy back-up for Evie? That is a much better investment of your time & energy because it will empower you if not for this situation then for the next.   Wishing you much peace and clarity while you are dealing w/the storm of NM.

[RB22]

I understand that she will have Evie for 2 days..(well unless you make other arrangements).  Can she bring Evie back to the house once you are home... pick up take out on the way so you can all have a meal together... give her a bit of time with the new baby and you can have one on one time with Evie... then let her leave to go home.

If she shows up the next day.... keep the door locked and ignore the doorbell. 

On more than one occasion I have told my mother that will be the reception she receives if she persists in NOT respecting my wishes.  I only had to do it once...

You may be hormonal, but your boundaries need to be respected whether you are hormonal or not.

Hugs,

RB

[seekingme5]

Thanks everyone for your replies.  I haven't had time to read them thoroughly and process everything, but wanted to make note of the fact that I am having a home birth this time (if all goes well!).  My parents live 10 minutes away, and I told them they only need to watch Evie for as long as I'm in hard labor and had a couple hours to recover, then DH is going to pick her up and bring her home.  This is why I really don't need them taking tons of time off (aside from the fact that I just plain don't want to entertain them) - we really only need them for a day or two depending on when I go into labor and how long it lasts, and if it's a weekend well, then they wouldn't need to take off any time at all!  In fact, if I somehow labor overnight and have the baby while DD is sleeping (which would be so perfect, but unlikely) then they won't even watch her.

I thought about having someone else watch her, but they live the closest and my therapist agreed it would at least give NM something to do so that she leaves me alone to labor/birth in peace.  She was at DD's birth but this time I don't want her there, which I don't think will be a problem because we are turning off our phones and locking the doors and windows when the time comes and not answering them, and my guess is she'll be too preoccupied with Evie anyways.

[seekingme5]

Ok I've had more time to process what you've all said, thank you again!

Honeybear - I like the idea of sending an email to our friends/family setting more specific expectations for visiting. I just don't know yet what the email would say. I don't think I'll mind visitors for a small part of each day, but I'd like to be the one to invite people over versus receiving a bunch of phone calls asking to come over. This worked fine when DD was born, however my parents were the only ones who just expected to come over daily for the first 9 days (which unfortunately I allowed as I was still in compliance mode), and then my parents took a combined 6 weeks of vacation time within DD's first 12 weeks of life, spending every single day at my house for hours on end. I really messed up by allowing them to do that, because I think that's partly to blame for why they don't seem to "get it" that they're not going to spend that much time with me again.

I agree that I just need to be strict and stick to the boundaries. I've been pretty good about this lately in fact, which is why I think NM is escalating some of her tactics. I seem to be ok with actually going through the motions of saying "no," but I think deep down it still bothers me and hurts me to get the "punishment" from NM every time...I'm wondering if that's why I've started having anxiety attacks. I'm TELLING myself I'm doing the right things and that I'm ok with her reaction, but deep down it still hurts and now it's manifesting as physical symptoms.

RB22 - I know what you mean about the mamabear instinct, only I must have ignored mine when DD was born because I just went with the flow, allowing my parents to completely overwhelm me and become way overinvolved until I practically had a breakdown - this breaking point came when DD was about 3 months old and I finally started telling them "no."

, I did talk to DH about this last night and he suggested that he manage the phone calls and requests from NM after I give birth, before I had a chance to bring it up to him.  That in itself is making me feel better.  I know I shouldn't rely on him to deal with her, but since I'll be recovering and a little emotional, at least he's willing to step up if I'm too overwhelmed.  He even said, "I don't care if your parents hate me!" lol

LettingGo - I agree that I need some sort of mantra, and I think mine might be "This is not about them!"  So if my parents try to interfere or upset me, making the birth of my son about them, I can remind myself not to get sucked into their efforts to make my life and my family and my choices all about them.

If for some reason my parents bail on watching Evie, I can always leave her with my mother in law as she's only a 20 minute drive away, so I'm not too worried about who will take her if NM decides to flake out.

What I'm trying to focus on right now is DD's upcoming birthday party, and also preparing for the home birth.  I'm hoping these activities will keep me focused on what's important and meaningful in my life right now, so I can hopefully stop dwelling so much on my interactions with NM.

I guess at this point I'm just going to hope for the best.  DH pointed out that NM is super super super passive aggressive, so I'm hoping that if she is mad because I don't let her come over every day, that she'll just pout and give me the silent treatment instead of trying something crazy or aggressive.  My gut's telling me though, that if there were a time when she'd snap or escalate and do something outrageous, this would be it.

[RB22]

Does your midwife offer a Doula service or someone she trusts to act as a doula?

A doula is someone who handles everything surrounding the birth... and after.. so the mother has nothing to do but concentrate on making her birth experience what she wants it to be. 

I have friends who are doula's, they are the first team to arrive when a mom goes into labor... they cook, clean, tend to kids while dad tends to mom, give dad a break if needed,  They open the door to the midwife... and help her set up.. then leave to manage the rest of the household... As unobtrusively as possible.

This may be an option for you... she could even run interference for you... if needed.

I am glad your H has stepped up and said he would help... I know that took a huge weight off my shoulders...

Hugs,
RB

[LettingGo]

Seeking me,
It is great that you have clarity on what you want, now all you have to do is say it.

 

I just don't know yet what the email would say. I don't think I'll mind visitors for a small part of each day, but I'd like to be the one to invite people over versus receiving a bunch of phone calls asking to come over.

Why not just say something like that, just say that you will personally like to set up a special Meet the New Member of the Family w/each of your family and friends and you will be giving everyone a call real soon to set up their own special time. You might want to do that now to get an idea of who you want to see first that can lend a hand by helping out while they visit. It was explained at my Baby Shower by one of my friends that when everyone comes to visit they will get to Select a Task that needs to be done to support the new parents (dishes, trash taken out, feed animals, vacuum, etc). Each day my DH and I provide a short list of things we needed done and each person got to pick which tasks they wanted to do BEFORE they got to visit w/the new family member. My MIL was always the first one to pick a task so that she could hold her new and only grandchild.

Yes, definitely having a personal mantra and family motto is very important to keep those boundaries strong.

I really messed up by allowing them to do that, because I think that's partly to blame for why they don't seem to "get it" that they're not going to spend that much time with me again.

You know I use to say the same thing about the Momster. First of all who says you don't have the freedom to change your mind and do what is best for your family in this situation. You have the right to do things differently, and the fact that they don't "get it" well they get it believe me they do they just don't respect it because well. . . you know the rest of that. Our bodies have a way of keeping us accountable to self. In our minds we can tell self, well I just don't care about that person and are body language says something different. If we really didn't care we wouldn't be so upset, we'd have peace in the situation. But we lack the peace because we feel powerless and our body reacts w/depression, anxiety, stress, etc.

My gut's telling me though, that if there were a time when she'd snap or escalate and do something outrageous, this would be it.

Trust the gut girlfriend! From what I remember about your NM she is a mix between enmeshed and ignoring which is like the Momster, if she can not control and enmesh she ignores w/her blessed silent treatments. Really all of us use to say oh you are so lucky to get the silent treatment -- sick right? You might be able to relate to that. Only another kid of the KoN could understand how great a Silent Treatment can be considering the alternative. Still sucks when you consider the NM is doing it to hurt you, but the silence can be golden! If your NM is any thing like mine, if there is an audience there will be a performance. They will get the spot light on them any way they can and they are great at knowing when we are most vulnerable and instead of being supportive and understanding like a normal Mom, the Momster takes advantage of the situation and are usually on their worst behavior and will find a way to hurt you in such a subtle way where others can not detect it and makes you look like the Postpartum, raging hormones, too sensitive, crazy new Mom. I would not let NM visit when other people are around, but you know her best. Put a time limit for each day and let your DH be the reinforcer that is what loving Hs do, they protect the ones they love, even from NMiLs, especially from NMiLs! Remember Compromising Boundaries = Compromising Self in regards to Ns. You know NM will not like, approve, or accept anything you do unless it is exactly her way. No that she does get it she just doesn't accept it, don't let her play the Dummy Mummy Card with you. Her not accepting and respecting your boundaries is her problem not yours.

So if you don't mind sharing what your plans for DD's birthday?   

[seekingme5]

   We are going to have a cat theme for her party, with cat decorations, cat-shaped sugar cookies, cat-shaped suckers (made from chocolate/almond bark), and a cat-decorated cake.  Plus we're going to get DD cat ears to wear at the party.  For some CRAZY reason, she's loved cats practically since she was born, and loved her cat stuffed animals and looking at pictures of cats even before she met a real life one.  Now whenever she sees a cat in a book, she bends down and gives it a kiss lol!  It's funny to me because I personally don't care for cats 

I showed her the evite to her party on the computer, which has a little cat on top of a cupcake, and she kissed the computer screen!

I'm going to go all-out girly with the decorations, making everything pink because this may be my last chance as DS is due soon after DD's birthday and they'll probably share parties a lot of the time.

[LettingGo]

Seekingme, the cat party sounds so adorable. Your DD is going to be so very excited. I love hearing how she   the computer screen when she saw the pic. of the cat. Even though you don't particularly care for cats, you are doing all this for your DD. What a great Mama you are to put your DD interest ahead of your own (especially for her birthday). I use to not like anything pink and princess due to the Momster and wouldn't you know my DD loves all that stuff and I have learned to enjoy it too. One minute we can be having a tea part and the next we can be taking our swords and fighting a bad witch or monster. My DD is nicknamed the Warrior Princess -- don't know where she gets that from  . From one Mama to the other can I make a little suggestion, that if you must combine DD and DS birthday celebration on the same day in the future (and I very much understand the practical reason for that) that you continue to let them pick their own themes (like you are now), each have their own little birthday cake, and each get sung Happy Birthday to separately. This way each of their individualities get celebrated. My Nsib and I had to share birthdays parties (when we had them), we were two years apart, but felt like twins who lacked their own individual identity. Everything was identical and shared down to the exact doll, the only difference was mine had a different color dress than hers. Anything I had my Nsib felt N-titled and took w/out asking. She did this throughout our lives, through teen years where she took my clothes from my closet w/out asking, stained them, then placed them back thinking I wouldn't realize it. She learned how to gaslight from the Momster and she did it pretty well. During my HS years I lived w/my Auntie two different times (one during my senior year, but had to go to the Momster's house to do chores on my weekends, didn't live there during the week, but had to do the chores) and that is when she fully took advantage of the situation. Even though I explained to her that I did not like that she took my things w/out asking and if she'd only asked I would say yes, if she took good care of them. She did not care about my feelings, didn't then, doesn't now. To this day she feels N-titled to what ever I have and does her D&D after she is done using and abusing. Being at WoN I realized and accepted that she is a N and I will not open up myself nor my family to her repeated abusive patterns.

[RB22]

I have a friend, her children's birthdays are within a couple of days of each other. They are girl and boy.  Her children are old enough where they each get a different party... one on saturday, one on sunday... Each has their own theme..and friends. It works for them.

I have twin girls... they have (for the most part) very different tastes in friends, colors, music... etc.   their parties have always been together... 3 tables.. one for twin A, one for twin B, these 2 tables are decorated differently and pushed together. Table 3 is for the cakes... one for each... and other foods.

When they were little it was crazy.... with half the preschool/kindergarden/firstgrade... etc... but it was fun.  And they do remember those parties with all those kids, foundly.  I remember all the work!!! and my kids smiling faces.

ENJOY... they grow up too fast.

Hugs,

RB

[seekingme5]

I like the idea of seperate themes/tables/cakes!  Otherwise it would have to be sooo generic since it's a boy and girl.  I am an only child, but I had to share birthday parties a couple of years with a male cousin of mine, and my parents paid for everything so they made the theme something for me and I remember the cousin being bummed that he had to blow out candles on a New Kids on the Block cake.

I figure once they are older they'll have sleepovers and friend parties that will be easy to separate, it's just the familiy parties for now that make sense to combine