Ns and physical abuse

[Sugar]

We all can attest to how Ns cause us psychological and emotional abuse. It's usually their primary tactic.

Out of curiosity, how many of you have endured physical abuse, as well?

I have a NM and she has physically abused me. Her NPD only became apparent once I met my fiance two years ago and wouldn't give him up just because she demanded it (and for the record, she has no reason other than baseless accusations and insanity to hate my fiance). Because of her hatred for him and outrage over me not submitting to her demands as I had previously done with everything else in my life, we have engaged in some nasty fights over my fiance which have often ended in her physically abusing me.

I'm not sure how detailed you are allowed to get in posts about physical abuse in posts, so I won't write more detailed about it until I know for sure I'm not breaking any rules. =)

[NewWings4MeNow]

Sugar,

I'm sorry you've suffered to this extent dealing with your own NM.  My mother never physically abused me, so I can't speak to that for you but perhaps others here can.

XNH, whom I was with for 12.5 years, showed a pattern of escalating abusiveness gradually through the years.  

When he was unemployed in the third year of our marriage, we argued in a guest bedroom, I sat on the bed and he leaned in over me in a rage in a way that frightened me.

Some years later, when d was one, he was again yelling at me and being verbally abusive; when I said I was leaving with d and had packed the car, he punched our kitchen wall (leaving no mark).  I drove down the driveway, called a family member, talked it out and went back home.  XNH expressed no emotion at all upon my return.  While in that house he had an altercation with the builder and, I was told, the builder socked him in the head and knocked him down so he came in and called the police.  The builder's assistant, outside and having seen it all, said that XNH struck the first blow.  Today I'd vote with the latter story as the actual truth, as XNH never pursued it legally.

In our last family home and at our separation, XNH blocked my passage in our bedroom, by phone after leaving said he would be entering the house and that I should hide in a closet, said he'd break windows to get in, and when I told him that I kept all doors and windows locked for my and d's safety being there alone, he just ... laughed ....  In his first week away he e-mailed that we couldn't afford to live separately so he'd be "returning to the home to live peaceably until the D".  Since he'd already threatened me, my lawyer called his and was told that XNH's real reason for returning was so that he could get in my face and "force a violent confrontation so he can take full custody of d."  Some time later he attempted a break-in of the house (police verified) the day after he told d he was going to the house to "get the cat".  

After our six-week psych eval, when 50:50 was awarded, he told me by phone that he'd (falsely) seen the results of my eval (he had not) and said, "If you ever do anything to go against me in any fashion, things will go badly for you."  Around that period he also filed a phony 911 police report against me reporting my attempted suicide, and referred to after my death.  The men I knew ALL, ALL told me to take that very seriously and alter my driving habits.

After we'd been D'd I think three years, XNH screamed at me into the phone, "YOU'RE GONNA BE IN A WORLD OF HURT!"

Late this past spring XNH finally smacked d in the head, while driving in his car, and scared the living shite out of her.  She reported him and they've been in joint therapy as she, now 13, makes her custody decision.

I also have an adopted female cousin, to whom I was very close as a child, but whose life path diverged radically from mine and even as a teen she got ANGRY at everything, was into drugs, had multiple abortions and married two addicted men.  She's the only female in my life who's physically attacked me (years ago) and, just several years ago when I tested the waters and drove a distance to see her again, I was there not ten minutes and she was aggressive toward me in her car to the point where I got out, walked away and drove eight hours home.  This past year her brother, my close cousin, told me I'd been right about her all along and that she'd become a beyond-flaming N with whom he wants no R after their parents die as she showed she'd take their money, wanted their "stuff" and did every end-run she could to usurp his responsibilities as his parents' executor.  N colors all the way.

The major writers and lots of Web sources say that intimidating/threatening body posture, touching in ANY fashion that's inappropriately aggressive (especially entitled and without remorse) and suggestions of future behaviors, are all indicators of the very high probability of escalating physical abuse and are not ever to be ignored.  I think, at one point, that I received from a women's resource center a chart showing the escalation of behavior indicators pointing to that probability.

I leave it to the WoN leadership to advise re: sharing the details of abuse you've suffered.  Without naming people or exact places, folks on WoN have been pretty direct in describing their experiences, but not excruciatingly graphic.  I'm sure you'll be well steered.

Keep coming here and reading/posting.  There are many lifetimes of wisdom, valuable lessons learned and tactics of "what works" to be gleaned here.

NewWings4MeNow

[Sugar]

I'm so sorry you had to endure that abuse, NewWings4MeNow. Have you escaped these people and completely cut off contact? I hope you did because you don't deserve that kind of treatment..

When I say things my NM really doesn't like (aka, the truth), she likes to smack a lot, on my face and my head. It's usually how a fight involving I have read somewhere that smacking like that is a subconscious attempt to make people submit to you and feel inferior, which makes sense taking into consideration my NM's raging over me not caving in to her demands.

Physical fights have escalated to her choking, shoving me, pulling my hair, and pinning me down to the ground. One fight which was the worst, she pinned me down to the ground and twisted my breasts, and later spit at me. That only happened once though, but I know that is just making excuses - it shouldn't have happened ever.

I haven't had a bad physical fight with her in a good period of time, though. It's just hard to STAY angry at her because she shifts moods so well - as vicious as she can be, she can be equally as kind when she wants to be. And these kindness phases last a long time. As soon as I don't agree with something, though, she becomes vicious again.

I still live with my NM because her and my father pay for my college tuition..that's the only reason I stay.

[NewWings4MeNow]

Sugar,

I will not give you legal advice or tell you what to do.  If you read your posts to a police officer they would tell you that if someone tried to strangle you they've committed a felony level crime against you and you have every right to report them.

From what you've written here, your NM isn't "vicious", she's physically assaultive.  

If you think you're stuck/trapped because of college tuition, I can only very gently say that you're just wrong.  What you're living through now you seem to have thought had to be the PRICE you have to pay for your education that will create indelible memories you'll have to bear for your lifetime which will impact every decision you make -- but this isn't so and this treatment should NEVER be the price a woman pays for an education.  You are not a slave and are not indentured.  There are other ways to find college funds, and the first thing to do is talk to a women's resource center, a crisis center, a domestic abuse shelter, about what you've been living through and why.  They can help direct you toward advisors who can help you find alternative ways.

People who abuse their power of position, which is what your NM has over you since her abuse is financial, physical and psychological, from what expert authors write, usually get worse as they age and their "kindness phases" usually are shorter and shorter.  I strongly suggest you find/get/borrow Lundy Bancroft's Why Does He Do That?  Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men and read it now as it will give you insights into the reasons and purposes of NM's abuses, though it's written from evidence of first-hand interviews with many, many men.  (If others here have references for Sugar to works resulting from studies of criminal-level abusive women, perhaps you could suggest them.)

I'm speaking my simplest truth to you here and now, because I've had enough experience and interactions with police through time to understand where they draw the line in terms of what constitutes what kind of behavior, and what they do about it.

If you have ANY kinds of physical marks from NM's assaults, bruises, cuts, torn hair strands, take time/date-stamped photos of them or keep a recorder handy, as these things constitute the physical proof/evidence you will have to have to have the legal right to protection for yourself should it again come to that.

Sugar, I really feel for you and hope you think seriously about the fact that you're giving up your world view of the notion of a safe life in a home, in exchange for education.  If you're young (20-ish+) and are enduring this, you have zero, zero obligation to be doing so, from NM or from any other human at any point in your life, anywhere for any reason.

Others here may disagree with my direct approach, and I welcome and respect those views.

With concern for all aspects of your safety,

NewWings4MeNow

[SusyP14]

I still live with my NM because her and my father pay for my college tuition..that's the only reason I stay.

I am sorry that you have withstood this abuse.

My NM never raised her voice or a hand to me and neither did xn. 

I hope you do not mind me mentioning that the price you are paying for college seems extremely high.

[CZBZ]

Oh Sugar!! What a terrible situation for you! Of course you can write about physical abuse on our forum. If you are writing any details that you fear might trigger other people, just put on the title of your post: "May Be Triggering". hat way people will know whether or not they can handle your thread that day.

And, because you have been through a tough time on the Internet, you will NEVER EVER be terminated from our forum without getting the grand opportunity to talk to me via email. This is not boot camp...sounds like you've already spent your time there! If you have any questions at all, sugar, email me here: wonmanagers@yahoo.com

What does your father do during your mother's rages? Is he a witness? That can make it even worse...to have someone witness the abuse and refuse to intervene. Do you get along with your father?



Hugs,
CZ

[betterdays]

I am sorry for your home situation, and very concerned for your well being, Sugar. I have tried a voice recorder, but you have to be close to get a good recording. Once my husband saw it on the counter, he seemed to know what it was, and stopped being so obviously threatening.  You could document the abuse with photos, and call 911 the next time anything occurs.  However, you do not have to wait if you feel you can act now.  You can make a police report based on past abuse.

I do understand about tuition, and you might want to visit the health center at school for a therapist appointment, and then the financial aid office.  Any violence is not to be tolerated, but holding you down, twisting your breasts, and spitting  is a thing you will regret putting up with for the sake of tuition.  I doubt you study very well with this kind of treatment, and the unpredictability of it all.  You do not deserve this treatment.

[RB22]

Sugar,

If you go into the financial aid office and speak to the director, they should be able to find away to help you gain your financial freedom for tuition and put you on the right track to finishing your education. Free and clear of the abusive parent.

Please go and speak to them.... they have helped me and my kids on numerous occasions.  Well worth the time to talk to them.

Hugs,

RB

[NewWings4MeNow]

Going to financial aid is a great suggestion, telling them the details of exactly what you're having to experience to pay for school, and asking for their assistance and ideas.

NewWings4MeNow

[Sugar]

Thank you for the caring and helpful advice, everyone..it's so very greatly appreciated.

If you think you're stuck/trapped because of college tuition, I can only very gently say that you're just wrong.  What you're living through now you seem to have thought had to be the PRICE you have to pay for your education that will create indelible memories you'll have to bear for your lifetime which will impact every decision you make -- but this isn't so and this treatment should NEVER be the price a woman pays for an education.  You are not a slave and are not indentured.  There are other ways to find college funds, and the first thing to do is talk to a women's resource center, a crisis center, a domestic abuse shelter, about what you've been living through and why.  They can help direct you toward advisors who can help you find alternative ways.

Well, the thing is I will be stuck with extensive loans if I don't let my parents pay. I hate to sound like I am being greedy or cheap, but college is so expensive and if I can avoid loans, I really want to. And it's not even just that - my fiance already has college loans that will need to be paid off as soon as he is done with college and we are married (which will be as soon as we are both finished with college). So you can see why it is so difficult for me not to accept my parents paying for it.

Also, my father would be destroyed if I just left. He is on my side, which enrages my NM. He would be crushed if I just left the house and he wasn't able to pay for my college, which he has worked so hard and saved up money for all his life. He has told me, "I never had my own apartment or spent tons of money as a young man, and it paid off because I have the money to pay for your education." Whenever I am upset about my NM calling me a "user" in fights for having my college paid for, my father tells me to ignore her and that she only says it to me because it's the only thing she can hold over me. He has even said that it makes absolutely no sense to him that she calls me a user over having my tuition paid and that even though they are married, that he has the absolute say over the money he earns.

And in all honesty, living with her has become much more bearable since I actually stood up to her and got more of a spine. I felt like the fights were worse when I didn't fight back as much vehemently telling her that my love for my fiance is something she cannot change. I always said it, but not as confidently at first because she did used to intimidate me, as she threatened that she would have my father harm my fiance. So, I would be afraid to fight back for fear that she would look to hurt the person I love most. When I saw my father was on my side (not really about my fiance..I really don't know where he stands on that. It's like he acts like it's a subject that doesn't exist, but he is definitely on my side when my NM abuses me), I was less scared to stand up for myself and it seemed like fights lessened over time. I guess when I didn't fight back, it made her feel like she was even more justified in abusing me. I hope it's clearer to all of you that I am not living in daily or frequent abuse anymore..the abuse was worst when she first found out I was seeing my fiance behind her back because I told her myself after seeing him half a year in secrecy, hoping she would accept him if I proved I knew him for a long period of time. Before I knew my fiance a long time, my NM forbid me to see him and accused him of all these crazy false things - by seeing him for so long without telling her, I hoped I would dispel these crazy thoughts in her mind..but back then, I didn't know I was dealing with a NM and that this was basically a plan bound to fail.

I strongly suggest you find/get/borrow Lundy Bancroft's Why Does He Do That?  Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men and read it now as it will give you insights into the reasons and purposes of NM's abuses, though it's written from evidence of first-hand interviews with many, many men.  (If others here have references for Sugar to works resulting from studies of criminal-level abusive women, perhaps you could suggest them.)

I would love to read that book, along with other NM books I have heard about. Unfortunately, my NM snoops in my things shamelessly. She has looked in my belongings without asking and felt completely justified in doing so merely because I went against her wishes of being with my fiance. She asks questions about everything, too. So, I don't doubt that she would eventually find self-help books and become a horror to deal with because I am reading them with her in mind. Do you have any ideas how I could read these books without risking her seeing them?

If you have ANY kinds of physical marks from NM's assaults, bruises, cuts, torn hair strands, take time/date-stamped photos of them or keep a recorder handy, as these things constitute the physical proof/evidence you will have to have to have the legal right to protection for yourself should it again come to that.

Yes, I have been doing that. My fiance bought me a special recorder to help me record professors during lecture and also to use to record my NM. Whenever I see a huge fight about to erupt, I put the recorder on without her seeing and it tapes the whole thing. My fiance keeps the files from the recorder on his computer for safe keeping. In the last fight I had with her, I took photos of a scratch she made on my arm. The thing with her is the way she abuses, she rarely has ever left any marks on me (oh, and when I attack her back in self defense and squeeze/pinch to get away from her, she will walk around ranting how it's ME who left bruises on her and is the abuser).

I am sorry that you have withstood this abuse.

My NM never raised her voice or a hand to me and neither did xn.  

I hope you do not mind me mentioning that the price you are paying for college seems extremely high.

Thank you, SusyP14..and no, I don't mind at all! I see for myself that I put up with a lot with my NM that most people wouldn't for a day. My fiance has even told me that he doesn't know how I deal with her and that he would have run away a long time ago. I guess I am just driven by my dreams so I put up with her..

Oh Sugar!! What a terrible situation for you! Of course you can write about physical abuse on our forum. If you are writing any details that you fear might trigger other people, just put on the title of your post: "May Be Triggering". hat way people will know whether or not they can handle your thread that day.

And, because you have been through a tough time on the Internet, you will NEVER EVER be terminated from our forum without getting the grand opportunity to talk to me via email. This is not boot camp...sounds like you've already spent your time there! If you have any questions at all, sugar, email me here: wonmanagers@yahoo.com

What does your father do during your mother's rages? Is he a witness? That can make it even worse...to have someone witness the abuse and refuse to intervene. Do you get along with your father?



Hugs,
CZ

Thanks so much for providing your e-mail! I will definitely save it to my contacts. =)

And I mentioned a little about my father earlier, I will go into more detail here. As I have said, he is very kind and loving to me. I get along very well with him and if he didn't live here with me, I probably would've left a long time ago. One time, my NM got into a very bad fight with me and threatened she would "throw me out of the house" and I was actually ready to get out because I couldn't take it. But my father came up to my room and looked so pitiful, telling me I can't leave my home. Mind you, my father is always a very tough kind of guy - never taking anyone's crap, always standing up for himself, and he's the kind of man you'd never see cry. The times I've seen him cry were few - such as tough times involving me, like when kids used to make me feel bad in school (they were very cliquish and isolated me for being the "quiet girl who likes to read and study") and when my grandmother died. So you can imagine how bad I felt to see him look so sad.

Whenever I buy stuff with the small amount of money I make working at my college a few hours a week, my father often gives me the money back saying I shouldn't have to pay for things like this when I don't make that much and tells me not to tell my NM. He has also confided in me that he thinks she is crazy and can't take her sometimes. He once even said he's going to leave her once I finish college, but I don't think it will actually happen.

He has witnessed her abusing me and he always stops her, yelling that she can't do that to me. That is why my NM started hitting me when he was out at work and then when the fight would be over by the time he got home, she told me not to tell him we were fighting. But I told him in confidence anyway because he has to know how she really is.

I am sorry for your home situation, and very concerned for your well being, Sugar. I have tried a voice recorder, but you have to be close to get a good recording. Once my husband saw it on the counter, he seemed to know what it was, and stopped being so obviously threatening.

The recorder I have actually works great; I don't even need to have it out for it to record crystal clear and from across the room. I can have it safely hidden in a closed bag while recording. I'm not sure if you are still in need of a recorder with your husband (I hope for your sake you have escaped him..), but if you do and want a really good one, I can give you the name of it.

I do understand about tuition, and you might want to visit the health center at school for a therapist appointment, and then the financial aid office.  Any violence is not to be tolerated, but holding you down, twisting your breasts, and spitting  is a thing you will regret putting up with for the sake of tuition.  I doubt you study very well with this kind of treatment, and the unpredictability of it all.  You do not deserve this treatment.

I actually went to the psychological services at my school and it was very unhelpful, unfortunately. They had psychology graduates as the counselors, not professionals. So, it was very uncomfortable for me - I felt like I was being interviewed, not like I could talk freely. And the woman I got kept asking me if I felt uncomfortable and blatantly said (not rudely, though) if I really wanted to be there or if someone was making me. It's true that my fiance urged me to go, but I really was trying to find answers and get help, and she wasn't helpful at all.

Though her insanity has interrupted my studying a few times, I still keep up a 4.0. I think it's because I'm just so determined to achieve my dream that I won't let her get in my way. I think studying has served as an escape for me too - it keeps my mind busy and off my NM, much like cleaning and watching TV does when I have no studying or it's the summertime and she is being a horror to live with.

Thanks again to all of you..it really means a lot.

[SusyP14]

Do you have any ideas how I could read these books without risking her seeing them?-Sugar

Sugar,

Do you have an iPod?  I get a lot of book on tape to listen during my long commute and she probably would not think to look through your iPod for book titles.  Just a thought!

[Sugar]

Do you have any ideas how I could read these books without risking her seeing them?-Sugar

Sugar,

Do you have an iPod?  I get a lot of book on tape to listen during my long commute and she probably would not think to look through your iPod for book titles.  Just a thought!

Thanks for the idea, Susy! I do have an iPod and I have a combination lock on it. Believe it or not, that was another place she tried to look, too.

Can you please direct me to places where I could get book sound files for my iPod? The problem is, if they cost money, I don't have a way of purchasing online..

[NewWings4MeNow]

I recommend a day/entire afternoon at Barnes & Noble.  They keep these types of books on the shelf and you can sit and pour through them, if you have no other options.

As to remaining in your living situation, if the requirement is that you live under their roof in order for your father to pay for your college, it seems to me that that's part of the problem.  

My dad was WWII era and saw it as part of his parental obligation to cover my college tuition (while I covered board and books).  Private colleges now, though, are radically more expensive.

If your NM is going through your personal items too, you're dealing with serious privacy boundaries violations all over the place as part of the price you're paying.

Does your fiance live at his home or live on his own?  Are you both over 21?  I'm trying to get a handle on your situation and wondering about whether you do have immediate options.  Also wondering about how/why your fiance would allow you to continue to live in such a situation knowing you're being physically abused?  

Until you're married your fiance's debt obligations aren't yours.  And if you don't currently have college loan debt, if you're a student and not working you may not qualify on your own but require a co-signatory on any loans (i.e. your father) -- I don't know this for sure, so perhaps others here can verify.

If you're living being physically abused by your NM and both of the most intimate men in your life know about it (your father and your fiance), yet it continues ... ??? what's the missing piece in this picture, I wonder? and have you received feedback from them about what kind of message it sends as to what kind of treatment you think you deserve for yourself?  I'm just asking, as you deserve MUCH better than this.

NewWings4MeNow

[Sugar]

Does your fiance live at his home or live on his own?  Are you both over 21?  I'm trying to get a handle on your situation and wondering about whether you do have immediate options.  Also wondering about how/why your fiance would allow you to continue to live in such a situation knowing you're being physically abused?

Oh my fiance is incredibly supportive and protective of me! In the beginning when the abuse was bad, he used to "hound" me (I put it in quotes because I don't mean that in a negative way, I mean it like he used to really talk to me and urge me all the time to get out and to at least look into the options. That is why I kind of reluctantly went to the psychological services at my school..I really only did it because he wanted me to, not because I wanted to personally. I was scared and uneasy to talk about it, honestly).

But after awhile, he saw how reluctant I was to move out because after all, it is so scary, and the program I am studying at school is really demanding. I know if I moved out and lived with my fiance, my NM would make my life a living HELL. She would accuse me of being a "sput" and nasty things like that. I don't think I could handle that on top of having to study difficult mater. So, my fiance respected my wishes and stopped pressing the idea of me moving out and in with him. He lives on his own, by the way.

Until you're married your fiance's debt obligations aren't yours.

Well..there is a reason we have to get married after we graduate, but I don't feel comfortable discussing it on the forums where unregistered people can see it. Once I get the PM feature, I can tell you then. So combined debt obligations of both my fiance and mine would be jointly shared right after college, which is a terrifying thought.

If you're living being physically abused by your NM and both of the most intimate men in your life know about it (your father and your fiance), yet it continues ... ??? what's the missing piece in this picture, I wonder? and have you received feedback from them about what kind of message it sends as to what kind of treatment you think you deserve for yourself?  I'm just asking, as you deserve MUCH better than this.

I hope you don't think negatively of my fiance. He is a wonderful, caring, and loving person - he is what keeps me the most sane in this whole situation. As I discussed earlier, he has urged me constantly in the past to get out, but as you know, I'd have to want to do that myself..and I am just so scared for more reasons than one. I'm the kind of person who really hates change (I guess when you think about it, who among us doesn't?) and I do find comfort in the idea of putting up with this situation until I finish school because it's stable and then being free. I hope you ladies here don't think I'm a coward for that.

Honestly, the abuse happens less and less now..I know that is not a normal way of thinking as abuse shouldn't happen at all. But she has actually been quite decent to live around lately. I am aware that if I bring up wanting her to accept my fiance, that nice mood would immediately vanish, though. So I don't talk about him - it's like the taboo subject in my house.

What hurts my fiance and I down is the hiding and secrecy we have to endure, as though loving one another is something "wrong" all because my NM doesn't approve. We can't do stuff like other couples do because of her. That is the only thing that won't go away as long as I live there, and I do admit that it's a huge burden to deal with. But we are managing to stay strong because we love each other that much.

And my father..well, he's hard to figure out. He admits my NM's crazy ways, but he never talks about the situation with my fiance. At the beginning, he was outraged that I had gone against my NM's demands of me not seeing my fiance because she painted this horrid picture of him with absurd accusations that apparently my father believed back then. Within a short period of time, though, he wasn't angry anymore and when I asked if they could just give my fiance a chance, he just said while looking like he felt bad for me that my NM doesn't want it. After that, he never spoke of it again - my father seems to like to sweep difficult things to talk about under the carpet with hopes that they will just go away.

Oh and about the age thing you asked - I feel kind of uneasy to post that. We are both over 18, though.

[inflatedheart]

Oh yes, I most definitely endured every kind of abuse imaginable from my N-parents, N-brother, and N-Sister. I have been slapped, choked, touched inappropriately, shaken, pushed, pinned down, and physically intimidated into a corner (not to mention the litany of verbal attacks, put-downs and cursing), almost always during some sort of conflict where I wanted independence or autonomy. Sugar, I think this is out of fear of losing you, the source of her narcissistic supply as well as threatening the notion that her wants, needs, opinions etc are of little consequence when it comes to making your OWN decisions.

I was in a similar situation in college. My parents weren't going to pay for my tuition, books etc (I took out a lot of loans), but they agreed to give me a little spending money now and then, which prevented me from starving. My financial need kept me bound to them and allowed them to continue to abuse me. This time was so very hard for me but I had no choice but to "play the game" and stay in the relationship for the sheer goal of surviving and finishing college. It is OKAY to "play the game" until you have a solid plan to get out of the relationship. The only thing that I recommend is that you seek some sort of help and support during this time if you are able. This can take the form of hanging out with us on the forums, getting some counseling, reading books on narcissism and abuse etc. Make a solid concrete plan for setting boundaries or getting out of the relationship and do all that you can to minimize interaction with the N in the meantime.

When I was still living with my parents, I was not often permitted access to resources or information because my mother snooped incessantly in my things. She even argued with me about the contents of a journal that I hid under a floorboard that was under the carpet, which also had a dresser standing on top of it. It amazes me that she found it in the first place! I often retreated to a trustworthy friend's house (where I kept all private things), a bookstore or internet cafe, which is how I ended up learning that what I was experiencing was abuse. How would you feel about keeping books, diaries and whatnot in his possession/at his place? He sounds like he is a huge source of support for you and I can't imagine that he would object to you having your own little place to store these items.