anxiety/fear sky high over N's latest, ready to give up....

[overwhelmed]

I really am ready to just throw it in.  I feel like I'm up against it all, by myself.  Today, we were to have court, the jury trial was to begin for the DV case in criminal court from july arrest.  Of course, another continuance.  The police officer who arrested N, was unavailable.  He was in cuba for the Navy on official business.  Ok, I can deal with yet another, put off.

Fast forward to this afternoon.  I got a call from the state attorney....same guy who BTW, last week changed his tune and was offering N a new plea bargin.  A new plea bargin AFTER I submitted evidence that he was he would be using and he felt did prove his guilt because everything was "inferred."  So AFTER getting evidence that he felt proved his guilt, he sent a NEW plea offer that was less than the first one he sent that N turned down.  That's right, this one allowed for no jail time.  He would admit guilt, 12 months batter's intervention program and alcohol screening, etc. I was let down on that alone but kept with a positive attitude the best I could knowing N wouldn't take it anyway.  The state attorney told me that because N and I have kids, the judge wouldn't give him any jail time anyway.  Oh really?  I asked.  He said yeah well he could lost his job and wouldn't be able to pay child support that he already doesn't pay.  I told him how disappointed I was, that N wouldn't lose his job because he owns his own business.  Furthermore, I let him know I was disappointed due to the fact that because he isn't a stranger, he'd be treated differently.  Afterall, in my eyes, the fact that he and I share children, makes it worse, not better.  At least with a stranger, I wouldn't have to see him anymore.  But let's fast forward to today.  My phone rings.....I didn't make it in time.  It was the SA asking me to call him back ASAP, he had a rather urgent matter to discuss with me. So I call back, literally one minute later.....at 4:59 and I got the recording saying they were closed.  So how can I call him back if I can't get through?  Five minutes later, my family attorney calls.  I figured it must be my attorney day.  Family attorney informs me he got a call from state attorney....how odd, they don't speak, they have nothing to do with each other.  He went on to tell me that the SA told him he recieved an email from N's defense attorney that appeared to be from ME....that's right, from me.  An e mail from a defense attorney that is from me....where I state something to the effet of I didn't want to proceed forward with the case.  N and I were coming to an agreement in family court that I felt was best for all parties involved and I would have my family attorney call him later in the week to discuss where things stood.  Ok, that's laughable enough.

So My family attorney proceeds to tell him that he is absolutely sure that this is NOT THE CASE.  For starters, we don't have any such "near agreement" in place....he went on to tell him that he has been in touch with me throughout this process and I have stuck to moving forward without hesitation.  Next, family attorney informed him I had been a client since 2009, how yankied around I've been by N, how fearful of him I've been, how I haven't ever waivered from that fact and that I've done everything in my power to try to keep N happy so I would be SAFE, to no avail.  He told the state attorney to do his job. 

Now let me tell you why this has me reeling in anxiety.....SA went from offering jail time in a plea, to not....and telling me a judge wouldn't vie it either.....next, SA repeated things he told N's attorney regarding the "email..."  which are things I told him.  I understand things I submitte for evidence would be available to the other side.  I didn't like it, it scared me but I understood that is the law of criminal court.   But where is it a law that what I tell him in conversations he repeats?  If I tell my family attorney something, he does not repeat it without my permission.  For heaven sake, why not just give it all away so N's over priced, well known criminal attorney knows exactly how to go at me in trial?  Furthermore, any word from what I say to N's attorney is as god as me talking to N myself.....and it fuels his fire since he NEEDS me to be a liar.....why in the world, would anyone fuel an abusers fire who already thinks "I did this to him..." he got arressted because "I had him arrested."  Same man who thinks if I were to say, "I don't want to cooperate...." all would be dropped?  Apparently, it will.  But, why feed that?  Why?  After geting as evidence, a conversation where N is telling me what to say?  which is against the law, a crime in and of itself but is he charged with anything more?   nope.  WHY DOESN'T ANYONE GET THAT I AM SCARED OF THIS MAN?  he isn't normal.  He chocked me and they call that a misdamenor that isn't worhty of jal tim e because he could "lose his job."  He did this in front of our children.  Perhaps I am just some wimpy woman who is over reacting.  HEY jerks, I am afraid of him because of what all he has done.....AND THAT IS NORMAL.  Perhaps they aren't afraid of him.  They aren't in the world with him, they haven't been told by him that he'd kill people they love and then kill himself and make them watch so they could spend the rest of their life knowing it was all their fault that people they loved died, needlessly. Yeah, what a dumb thing to say right?  Fault me, I am scared of him and that is APPROPRIATE.  It isn't NORMAL.  Nothing he's done or said to me or threatened me with is normal.  I'd be abnormal to not be scared.  I thought these poeple had special training in such matters.

I told my attorney when he calls me tomorrow, if he asks if I sent that, I will say NO but stop there because it seems whatever I say afterward, HE WILL TELL THE DEFENSE ATTORNEY WHICH IS JST LIKE TELLING THE PHYSCO HIMSELF.

[overwhelmed]

Excuse typos, hit post too soon and I'm on a string of complaints.  Next, it is supposed to be the state against N, not me against him. So even if I had sent that stupid email....what's that got to do with me?  I have cooperated this entrie time, told him repeatedly, my wishes, my fear, etc.....if it's the state against him and he knows he's guilty based on the evidence I submitted, why put me in the middle?  I don't want it on me.......tell his damn attorney you don't care what I say, assuming I sent it, you know what he did and it's your job to serve justice on behalf of the state. 

This entire time, N has followed classic abuser flawed thinking....why validate that for him?  he's above the law, he's ordered not to drink as a condition of his release.....HE DOES ALL THE TIME, still passes those tests.  I have proof he does from private investigator.  No, I didn't turn that over because I'm not vindictive, I did that for family court and I am not trying to add fuel to the fire.  Plus, even if I did, they probably wouldn't put him in jail pending trial as it states, as I was told if he were to violate a condition of his release which includes contact with me....what a load of crap....he's got recorded conversations of us talking where he's telling me what to say....two laws broken and N is still out. He also drinks and just two weeks ago, got so drunk he was kicked out of a bar.....he's above the law, he knows it and even says it on these recorde conversations as he tells me the state isn't going to "actually do the work...."  and he's right!

My family attorney told me to answer his question with a no....then tell him from word forward, I'd like for the rest of what I'm about to say to stay confidential.  He said if the SA says he can't do that, then to tell him then that's all I have to say about it.  And that if I am supeonaed to court, I will be telling the truth and ONLY the truth as I have this entire time.  But he said he should NOT have to speak of conversations he and I have.

My goodness, this just becomes more and more disappointing.  Not N's behavior, that's the only part that is consistent.  They drop this case of some email I supposedly sent, I"m as good as dad.  No joke.  To even suggest it's a possibility even if I did, just fules N's hate for me.  Why won't anyone step up and take me out of the middle?  Well I'm about to do it myself because it seems everyone is an idiot in this case and finds empowering N, "no big deal."

[RB22]

(((((((Overwhelmed)))))))))

I am sorry.

[alatariel]

   I'm so sorry you're dealing with this and that our "justice" system has let you down and protected that forking slimeball instead of you and your helpless kids.

[Imogene]

Did you ask your attorney why this is happening?  I mean, it sounds like the state is making its decisions based on some fantasy about your relationship with your ex rather than the reality of an abusive situation.  It sounds so very patriarchal.  Sigh.  I'm so sorry.

[JennyWren]

         Grrrrrrrrr. I am absolutely hopping mad. I used to think "Justice" WAS justice....and that laws were there to keep the honest and good protected. In fact...the legal system is ACTUALLY about who makes the most plausible argument. Even if the argument is built out of stinky pile upon pile of festering bullshite.

Ns and the legal system are made for each other. Manipulate and twist facts and logic until their will is railroading everything else.

That said.....we can only deal with the system that exists...and make the best of it as is.

Somehow Egg has put a few new spins on things. The argument that he is such a responsible money provider...and it would be hurting his dear darling family to put him in jail is SO N it should be wearing a sign. He has been a physically, verbally and emotionally abusive man...and somehow he should be able to stay out of prison so he can keep a job. For money he isn`t paying you.

It seems fairly key to THAT argument to collect evidence that he DOESN`T pay as he should...if he is avoiding it. Because that little oh-so-caring-financial-provider argument falls right out of bed if he isn`t paying up. That`s before the fact that he has a business...not just a job.

I am convinced that to lawyers it is all a kind of game. And they are a competitive bunch. Each one wants to win. Even if they know they are on the side of moral repugnance. (I am sure there are SOME who are morally sound...but I am convinced most just like to argue, however mad the logic is)

All you can do overwhelmed....dear brave, courageous, brilliant overwhelmed...all you can do is play the stupid game. Present the argument YOUR way. Do not let him take the lead...or react to HIM. You KNOW the truth. (My favourite quote courtesy of RB!  ) You know it overwhelmed. That man is violent, and nasty. Real nasty. Your voice must be heard.

If you are frightened...WHO WOULDN`T BE????....say so. Maybe even put it in writing. You are afraid of the consequences of this for yourself and your family. He is an abuser. He scares you because you know him better than ANYBODY. You know him better than the lawyers.

Sorry....I`ve gone on a bit. You are SO BRAVE to be doing all this. You deserve support through this legal minefield. Not barriers put up. The continual delays will be ongoing....and Egg knows how the longer this goes on..the more the fear and anxiety will eat at you.



Egg will continue to wow the legal guys with his plausible b*llocks.....I think of him as a raging nightmare of an out of control lunatic...because of the revolting behaviour we know about...but I am assuming, like many Ns, he has a charismatic side which sidles up and is the picture of innocence.

I don`t recall you ever speaking about him this way...so maybe he is a pig 24/7....but somehow I doubt it. Rather I suspect that he is turning on the charm and Mr Nice Guy act. And presenting his "side" of things.

He is a master mind-botherer. And I would like to take him to the Court of JW...where he would not get jail....but a close encounter with a steam roller....and become an omlette.

Overwhelmed...I am so sorry you are grappling with all this....with the Court stuff being quite enough alone....but we know...it is also on top of coming to terms with what`s happened. And that is hard enough on it`s own. 

[overwhelmed]

Sory if in my ramblings I wasn't clear.  I typed without contacts to boot, couldn't see a lick.  They aren't dropping the charges.  I was fit to be tied that some crazy email surfaced, from me through N's attorney to the state attorney.  And from this email, the state attorney entertained it coudl be real or from me.  IT IS NOT.  Why did some bogus email appear supposedly from me through N's attorney?  Because N is an N.  Because he got some dumb idea on how to throw things off balance.  The idea of it working is nuts and the SA ASKING, calling to check on it's legitimacy, annoys me to no end.  Alongside the other things I ranted on about.  My attorney knows why it's happening, beause N is a liar.  A master liar.  Guess what'll happen to him over this stunt?  nothing I'm sure.  Nothing at all.  But lets say one of us normal people did such a crazy thing?  Well, we wouldn't now would we?  Who even gets an idea like that and follows through but an N? 

Oh Jenny, you crack me up......a steam roller and omlettes?  hahahahahha

Whatever, he threw me off balance alright.  But then, I got up and now, he fed me.  I'm going to see this stupid, boring thing through.....not only because I want him held accountable and to know, he will not abuse me, I will NOT be quiet.  Also, because he doesn't want me to see it through, that alone is reason enough for me to see it through.  Watch out egg, I'm back and I've got more energy than before your latest stunt.  Thanks for turning my brain back on you arsehole.

[overwhelmed]

Oh and N, for the latest stunt, I turn over two PI followings two weeks apart of you drinking.....getting kicked out of a bar because you are so intoxicated.  I wasn't going to do it.....mostly because I really don't care to play games.....I was just making sure I had proof of who you are, even more proof.  But, you had to play games and send some email to your attorney as if I wrote it.  For each lie you tell, I will reveal a truth.  Keep it up.  Come on, I have plenty more........but lets see what this gets you.  If nothing else, I know under your smear campaign, you're the one sweating, shows in your silly games.  You play games and lie and I will tell the truth.....compete there you raving, abusive, freak of egg basket.  (yes, I am talking to him as if he can hear me only, I won't talk to where he can hear me, I will show him with actions.....two PI survallance being taken down to SA office right about.....NOW).

[daisyk9292]

overwhelmed - I'm so sorry you have to fight this battle. I'm sure it seems like an endless nightmare.

Nothing at all.  But lets say one of us normal people did such a crazy thing?  Well, we wouldn't now would we?  Who even gets an idea like that and follows through but an N? 

After reading your first posts, this was one thought running through my mind. This aspect of N's is what drives me nuts. It's like being stuck in a twilight zone episode. Everyone around you starts to become under the N's spell, they can't see it. Not even an SA!!

I'm so very naive, always have been, that even with all I know about narcissism, abusers, I still find it hard to believe that N's can manipulate the legal system.

I was raised to trust and believe in authority figures of all kinds. Honestly I am so incredibly lucky I haven't suffered worse things than I have,  due to how trusting I have been.

Now I don't know how to trust anyone. It's a horrible way to face life everyday like that.

I feel like we're all soldiers, in a war. We get mini-breaks between the battles. But we know another attack of one kind or another is on the way. We can never let our guard down.

[pearlsb4swine]

Overwhelmed, I am so angry at what is happening to you I don't know what to say.

I find it outrageous that the SA would behave as he is behaving.  Of course I am very naive in these matters.  I suppose you just have to wait and see what he does, and follow your lawyer's advice.

I think maybe we need to organize a WON convention, and all of us come to wherever you are and demonstrate in front of the courthouse.  Call the local news station.  The Egg needs to fry!!!!  We can make T shirts.  Maybe the light of some public attention would force the SA to do his job.  He needs to man up already.

pearls

[Chime]

Overwhelmed -
  It's all so unbelievable, and yet...
seems a lot of us have been there.  It always shocks me to read about these things we've all endured.
Life with ClusterBs is crazymaking.  And the ClusterB messing with you sounds a little psychopathic. 
  You hang in there.  Keep doing things to keep yourself safe. But, remember to something nice for yourself.  Something calming   

We're hear to listen!
 
Chime

[Legs]

yeah, what she said. I am forever stunned at how the n comes out smelling like a rose no matter what evil they do and how we are endlessly punished for their bad behavior. Makes me want to flip out and commit some atrocity,but it needs to be BIG!!!! Bigger than I can think of how to engineer right now..maybe later when I feel stronger.


Legs

[RB22]

I think maybe we need to organize a WON convention, and all of us come to wherever you are and demonstrate in front of the courthouse.  Call the local news station.  The Egg needs to fry!!!!  We can make T shirts.  Maybe the light of some public attention would force the SA to do his job.  He needs to man up already.

pearls

I think I live close to Overwhelmed. For WoN convention to support Overwhelmed, I can put up 6 people in my house and another 5 in my camper.    So come on down!!!  Campfire round up and next days planning sessions begin at 8 near the campfire. 

I have makings for smore's....

[Legs]

<<The Egg needs to fry!!!!  We can make T shirts>>



LMAOLMAOrockrockrockrockrockrockrockroc krockrockrockrockrockrockrockrockrock

Legs

[Rosemary]

Sorry to hear about the latest stunt Overwhelmed .

glad you  have some more amunition  though just keep on fighting the BAZTURDS   

I always thought justice in the US was tougher than here ,but  it doesnt seem so (i think you are in US   , maybe im wrong )
     

[MoreMyself]

I have nothing to add except to say how sorry I am about what is happening to you.  Don't quit, though, keep on the path you are on. 

As Daisy said, it's enough to make us not trust again.   

[overwhelmed]

Picket the state attorneys office?  hahahaha....I have a better office....right outside of N's pretty litle office, for all his clients to see.  Oh that cracks me up.  His fragile egg shell would crack in to piecs and I bet the way he scares me, you guys would laigh him down to size. Make t shirts with his face in the middle of a fried egg......signs that say "fry the egg....."  I'd love it if the news around here would give a damn.....there little occasional financial advice expert up there.....the recording of him saying all those nasty things to me in front of our d and son a year and half ago......OH MY, the vision of that truth streeming through central FL's tv sets.......that would be such an empowering moment.  The bigger I got with spreading the truth, the more deflated he'd get.  I wish I had enough nerve to put his mug shot right on his companys face book page.  Mostly because it probably wouldn't get noticed for at least a day by them.......but I remind myself that I don't need to be that way.  I'm have to smack my hands off.  Especially after his stunts.  Sigh.

I know N's email password.....at least the email he uses outside of work.....his attorney emails him there and others he doesn't want associated with his work email.  I checke it tonight to see if there was a copy of this "email I sent his attorney....."  There wasn't.  But, there was an email from N to his attorney sent today.....and his latest is.....he was court ordered to produce his financial disclosure by the 18th of january.  He was a few days late....with a lot missing.  My attorney gave them 7 days to produce it or he will file contempt motion.  So today is his last day.....his attorney told him to have it to his office before close or the "world would be coming to an end."  Even his own attorney tells him he has to do it, no way around it, etc.  Except, for an N there is ALWAYS A WAY AROUND IT....so his latest is, he sends his attorney an email that said, "Mr. smarmy attorney of mine, overwhelmed and I have reached an agreement.  her attorney will send over the finialized agreement within the next few days.  Because of this, I know there isn't any reason for me to get the rest of "financial disclosure" down to you today.  "

BUT WE DON'T HAVE AN AGREEMENT.  NOT EVEN CLOSE.  No way would I unless it said I could move....then I won't push him to abide by the law and he can keep his wittle buisness records safe and sound in his possession.  No move....abide by the law.  Agreement?  hahahahah, what will he thinki of next?  can't wait to have my family attorney call his attorney and have fun with messing with N.  Perhaps he should tell N's attorney we've agreed to my moving but he can draft it up because N has, several times, let my attorney draw something up he said he'd agree too....only to not sign.  so N's attorney can use N's money to draft up a deal N would never ever sign    you know, since we came to an agreement and all. 

What a liar. 

[Freezer Burned]

What a liar.

(((((overwhelmed)))))
What a royal pain. At least you are able to find some way to laugh about it.

[RB22]

Don't you just love the communication triangulation that goes on.   

Now it's him, your attorney against his attorney.. because you have an agreement and the only one clueless to the agreement is his attorney.    He will switch it around to you and him on the same (agreeing) side against YOUR attorney.  because you and He have an agreement.. and it can't be his responsibility to tell YOUR attorney now can it ?  And there will be another triangle... and another and another.

Don't really try to follow it... it will make your head hurt.  But be aware...

He will use these triangles to back you into a corner... and distract you from the criminal case...if he does it enough he is hoping you will give up or drop something... stay vigilant.. and organized so nothing can drop.

Stay Focused... YOU KNOW THE TRUTH....

YOU do NOT Have an agreement with egg.  Anything anyone else has heard is not true.

[Freezer Burned]

Thanks RB, for that explanation of what this crazy mess is all about. I assume that this type of triangulation is one of the reasons why some targets refuse to speak at all to the N during the divorce process and insist that the lawyers do all the negotiating between themselves.

[RB22]

Freezer,

I bet those that let the lawyers deal with it... probably keep their sanity longer... and less in their wallet. 

The thing of it is.. I don't want overwhelmed to be surprised when egg starts to lie further and tell everyone that he and Overwhelmed had an agreement and she renaged on the deal.  Especially when there was no agreement to begin with!  But he will probably try this... so be prepared.

I don't know how you can prove he sent the email, without tipping your hand that you have access to his email account.  But he will most likely counter that if OW had access to the email account, then SHE must have sent the email to make HIM look like the liar!!!

A Catch 22 situation with no winners... but a lot of diversion and a lot of wasted time and energy.. on lies.

Remember OW -  You know the truth!

Hugs,

RB

[JennyWren]

I assume that this type of triangulation is one of the reasons why some targets refuse to speak at all to the N during the divorce process and insist that the lawyers do all the negotiating between themselves.

That is exactly what I did. Still BigBird was the puppet-master of his lawyer. My lawyer had known BigBird`s lawyer socially for years....and kept apologising on his behalf...saying "This isn`t coming from [BigBird`s lawyer]"
Ns are very well suited to the legal system, because as I was ranting earlier...it is not about facts so much as putting the most plausible argument. And that`s what they do all day long.

BigBird`s number one tactic was distraction.

He would bombard me with irrelevant attacks while he tried to slip his main lies and tricks under the carpet oh-so-silently.

So beware Overwhelmed....I think the best bit of advice ever is this one....

Stay Focused... YOU KNOW THE TRUTH....
 

Our most wise and insightful RB has it nailed. Keep focused.....whatever he throws. He is an abusive man....and you wish to take the matter before a Court.

He will wiggle and squirm and play the most convoluted games involving as many people he can drag in.

But the bottom line is....he is an angry abusive man. And this is not the first....or only time he has behaved this way.

Hang on in there Overwhelmed. Eggs are very good at rolling about in an unpredictable chaotic manner....but it only takes one well aimed blow...and their scrambled.

[pearlsb4swine]

So, so true.  You know the truth, overwhelmed.  Where there are Ns, there are triangles.  Ns even tell triangle shaped lies.

Time to fry that Egg!      Time for him to roll chaotically over and over, till he flips himself off the table.  And there you are, ready to catch him with a nice hot frying pan!

Pearls

[CZBZ]

"Don't really try to follow it... it will make your head hurt.  But be aware..." ~RB

You are soooooooooooo right, RB!! Triangles abound with Ns and no matter how many times we read about the Karpman Drama Triangle, we get ourselves caught up in the mess before we recognize what's going on!

Ns use the drama triangle to confuse people, pass the buck, garner pity, be the hero, make excuses, scapegoat, and most of all: Pit People Against Each Other.

What your 'x' is doing right now, Overwhelmed, is so typical. He mentions people's names as if they're aligned in an agreement which makes the other person feel  less powerful. OR confused. I'm sure his latest email confused the attorney. It's that state of confusion that gives Ns and advantage, like a head start. I think psychologists should write a book called Cognitive Dissonance and the Narcissist. People are left stammering around for a short time, trying to figure out what's going on and in the meantime, the N is crossing the finish line.

People might think the N brings in other people because he or she doesn't feel powerful enough on their own. Maybe that's true for some Ns but certainly not those manipulative Ns like the egg you hooked up with. 

Y'all are so funny!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 


CZ
 

[RB22]

Hang on in there Overwhelmed. Eggs are very good at rolling about in an unpredictable chaotic manner....but it only takes one well aimed blow...and their scrambled.

I loved this one so much I shared it with my D, who is dealing with her own Narcdaddy, regarding him wanting to be a presence in her baby's life.  WTF.. he didn't want to be a presence in his own D's life.    It's ok.. D told me " I still DON'T trust him."    She is going into this with her eyes wide open.    he tried the triangulation route during one of their talks... and she handed it right back to him.    Here's hoping she can see it coming... or step back from it just a bit and see it.  Or listen to someone else who sees it...

Good luck overwhelmed... I am sending prayers and good thoughts your way... even thinking of picking up a white candle or 3 ....

Hugs,

RB